Posts by Ultimate Axiom

29

New Armageddon date?

by neat blue dog in

looking at the most recent wt the study article focuses on the jubilees.

the made a separate box in the article to highlight the math behind jubilees, and i'm wondering if they're trying to get people thinking and stir up the pot without actually making a false prophecy.

for instance: jubilees happened every 7 times 7 years.

Ultimate Axiom

It was counting jubilees that gave Rutherford his 1925 date, only he started from 1575 BCE. It's merely a case of pick a date, any date, to get the answer you want.

25

Overlapping Generations

by Lost in the fog in

perhaps this explains why the gb have a fixation with time and chronology.

also why they keep their adherents in a prison away from the real world.

lol.

I take your point waton, but if DS's reasoning had applied to the actual 1914 generation it would have taken them until about now to ditch the literal interpretation of generation, but they they ditched it almost 25 years ago. So I would expect them to ditch the "one generation with overlapping groups" comfortably before the passage of time proves it wrong. In any event, I will be long gone by then so I'll never know.

25

Overlapping Generations

by Lost in the fog in

perhaps this explains why the gb have a fixation with time and chronology.

also why they keep their adherents in a prison away from the real world.

lol.

Ultimate Axiom

D. Splane does not teach overlapping generations

Spot on!

The WT does not teach "overlapping generations", it teaches "one" generation. One generation that includes people born in the 1890s with some born in the 1960s, so long as those people are of the anointed and their lives overlap while they were anointed. Those of the latter group could live into the 2050s, so they have about thirty years to come up with something else. I doubt I will live long enough to see that, but it will no doubt be something even more absurd, if that is even possible.

11

Why do JWs reject the 587/586 BCE date?

by Doug Mason in

i do not want this to develop into another discussion on "607 bce date is wrong".. when the a-e section of "aid to bible understanding" was published, i was able to show that the article on "chronology" employed deceptive techniques when it cited its sources.

whenever i provided jws the evidence in print, it was like water off a duck's back.

"the brothers in brooklyn have done all the research, write to them", they would tell me.. i soon recognised that the jws followed the wts because of who it claimed to be.. it became clear that another, stronger force existed--the impact of shunning with the loss of close friendships and with the impact on their family relationships.. one could only stand by with concern thinking of the impact of the cognitive dissonance and observing the regular changes requiring lock-step obedience.

Ultimate Axiom

The debate over 607/606 v 587 is not new. In the October 1st Watchtower 1904 page 296 (RP 3436) the following letter was published;

Russell’s answer covered several pages and included the following;

He then went on to explain how the year 587 would do irreparable damage to his parallel dispensations theories published in his "Divine Plan of The Ages".

Thus JWs reject 587 purely on the basis of Russell's parallel dispensation, although they don't actually know that.

32

Weird Jehovah’s Witnesses

by minimus in

jw
friends

is it my imagination or are most witnesses weird, odd, and “different “?

it seems every congregation has a couple of weirdo elders, pioneers and ministerial servants.

and then you see those witnesses who attend meetings but most people seldom associate with them because... they are eccentric..

Ultimate Axiom

A long standing elder told me recently that the reason there are so many weird people among JWs is that no other organisation would have them.

20

I hate it when they say; “Don’t worry, Jehovah will take care of it”

by I believe in overlapping in

i happen to run into a couple of elders and one of their bible studies was with them.

after we said our formal greetings to each other we caught up on each other’s history.

somehow the conversation took a turn into politics.

Ultimate Axiom

They don't live in a way that indicates they actually believe the world will not last more than a few years

Spot on! And that’s been the case throughout my lifetime at least. There were those back in 1914 who didn’t plant next year’s crops, but since then most JW’s have hedged their bets.

There are exceptions of course, like those who sold their homes in the 1970s to pioneer till the end and sadly paid the price. ‘Jehovah will take care of it' is similar to the WT's other favourite piece of advice, ‘seek first the kingdom and everything else will be added to you’.

In this case however, they cannot hide behind the ‘group’ thing that blondie has pointed out, for that is definitely aimed at the individual. Of course, anyone naïve and stupid enough (like me when I was young) to take that at face value quickly learns that nothing is added, except hunger pains.

3

Massive Shout Out to (JW) life saving Irish Doctor!

by Diogenesister in

can we get the most massive shout out for retired surgeon dr. don macnamarra.

at point 16.29 in the radio show you can hear him discuss doing what i have always dreamed of doing.. a young woman came in through.a & e, victims of an rta, with a ruptured spleen.

there is no alternative in this case but immediate surgical intervention and literally pints of blood.

Ultimate Axiom

So, she’s glad he sinned, but she’d be happy for Jehovah to condemn his for doing so. JW hypocrisy never ceases to amuse.

smiddy3 - quite agree, it must be a very heavy burden to carry around for the rest of your life. Is it right for the rest of us to say that we are 'glad' we never had to face that choice? For when I was PIMI I would have refused my child blood, and it is only good fortune that I have not had to pay the price for that decision.

47

Day One After Armgeddon written by a JW awaiting the Big A w/eager expectation - Warning: LOOOONG!!!

by Eve Deceived in

once we found out we were all witnesses, we all hugged.

now we just had to see if our kingdom hall was still standing.

when we came to the hall we had such a huge shock.. there were so many people there.

Ultimate Axiom

It would seem that creating fanciful stories about the coming ‘New Order’ is not a recent phenomena. Back in 1920 the following appeared in The Golden Age magazine (Oct 13, page 30). You will note that their expectations were not of a Big A, but rather a restoration of Israel, Joshua style, by slaughtering all their enemies, followed by a resurrection of the Worthies of Old who would gradually take over the reigns of government, while the rest of the world carried on as usual.

In the Days of Fulfillment-A Phantasy : as Leslie Emerson

It was a beautiful summer evening. The golden glory of the sunset and the gentle breeze, through the rich green of the trees in the city park, were in pitiful contrast with the scenes of ruin and wreckage which Mr. Porter passed on his way home. Crossing the park he came to a house sadly battered, the entire front being rendered useless. "Just to think," he murmured as he ascended the stairs, "once this was the Whiittaker mansion. Now it stands a mute testimony to the spirit of wanton destructiveness."

"That you, Uncle Jimmy?" cried a boyish voice from within. "Give the password." In another moment the broken door of the former study of Doctor Jonathan Whittaker was thrown open, and the two friends were again together after a day of thrilling events.

"O Uncle," said the boy presently, "how I thank God for your safe return!" "And I for yours, Philip", said the older man, reverently. "And," continued the boy, “I have ready the best supper in weeks. Have been foraging! No, I did not steal anything," he said, laughing. "Fishing all morning, then coming home I found cabbage, lettuce and turnips near a deserted farm-house. A neighbor kindly sold me a small loaf of bread."

"My dear boy, I have eaten nothing since morning. Your supper was a hungry man's meal. I have something that will interest you deeply. I was standing near the ruins of the building that once bore the name of Cooper, Porter & Co., when a former business friend came down Commerce Street and recognizing me said: 'Porter, have you heard the latest news from Palestine?' 'NO.' I replied, 'I probably have not. I know of the dreadful uprising against the Jews and of the reported destruction of their enemies, a wholesale slaughter according to reported accounts: nothing short of a miracle, just when it seemed that the newly established nation was facing utter ruin. Have you anything later?'
“ 'Indeed I have!' he replied, handing me this newspaper."
"Please read it, Uncle," said the boy, his face aglow. Mr. Porter read:
"Jerusalem saved! Palestine rejoicing! Jews by thousands accept Messiah! Former prophets declared awakened from the grave! Jews confronted by a gigantic contract in burying of corpses of their enemies! Appalling slaughter! Pestilence threatens unless bodies are disposed of! Notable leaders claimed to be Noah, Abraham, Moses, Joseph, Isaiah, et al, in charge of affairs! Report discredited! Fraud suspected."

"No, no." said Mr. Porter, as he threw down the paper, his eyes filling with tears. "It is no fraud; it is God's work. It is the resurrection of the Ancient Worthies. Oh, to think, Philip, that you and I should live to see this hour!"

The man of sixty and the boy of nineteen knelt together, thanking God for the manifestation of His marvellous power in behalf of His ancient people, Israel, especially that at last so many were able to see in Him whom they hitherto doubted - THE LONG-PROMISTED MESSIAH.

Philip took from an upper shelf a dark red volume entitled "Studies in the Scriptures, Volume Four". "Here it is, Uncle; this was my mother's book." He read as follows:

"The news of the discomfiture of the hosts of Gog and Magog, and of the wonderful deliverance of Israel from their enemies, will be speedily followed by the news of the appearance of their renowned fathers resurrected, and of the establishment of a government with these at its head and of the general conversion of Israel to their long-rejected Messiah. And no doubt much of this will pass for fraud amongst the Gentiles, and the Ancient Worthies will be classified as imposters." - "Battle of Armageddon," Page 628.

He also read from pages 626, 627. 640 and 641.

"Praise the Lord!" said Mr. Porter, "It will not be long, before we may have our dear ones restored from death. Let us still more earnestly walk the ways of righteousness. Oh who would not love and serve our Lord in this dawn of His day of blessing"

He was silent some moments and then added: "Just to think, Philip, Pastor Russell published the Fourth Volume of Scripture Studies, fore-telling these very events, back in 1897: and now we are living in the DAYS OF PROPHETIC FULFILLMENT."

31

A Witness on Facebook posted why JW is not a cult!

by Addison0998 in

.

Ultimate Axiom

Addison0998 - Number 8 is a big LIE!

fastJehu - 08. Big lie.

Is it? Do either of you two know? As St George of England posted, Robert Ciranko is President of the WTB&TS of Pennsylvania, and Leon Weaver Jr is President of the WTB&TS of New York. I doubt very much if many Dubs have heard of either of those guys.

23

A little rant about prayer

by BourneIdentity in

is god responsible for every good thing that happens in your life?

i ask this because a brother gave a talk several weeks ago and said that.

he said when anything positive happens, we must not assume it was by mere coincidence, but we have to have 100% confidence that jehovah cares for us and was involved.. however, people complain that jehovah doesn’t answer their prayers and are told you have to keep asking, you need to show him you really want it bad.

Ultimate Axiom

Those who believe that their prayer has been answered when an outcome they have prayed for actually happens generally fall for the idea that “ALL prayers are answered, it’s just that sometimes the answer is no”. You cannot reason logically with such people. A parent watching their child starve to death while praying for food is simply unfortunate - their prayer WAS answered.

Such people are simply unable to see that the expression, “there but for the grace of God goes I” simply means, “there but for the lack of grace goes him”. Why God should discriminate so much doesn’t enter their heads, they are just thankful to God that He has provided for them. The idea of questioning why they have been favoured while others have not doesn't arise, after all, that would be questioning God's way of doing things, and that would never do.